It might be interesting to further discuss the differences in how various people react. For example, some startle easily while others remain calm in the exact same situation. What accounts for why some people remain calm and clear headed when facing a threat, vs others that "panic"?
It might come down to how well we have learned to live with our personal version of the freeze response. I have lived in a permanent state of high anxiety all my life, which means I have actually learned how to live with it. I may appear calm and in control, when in fact every "danger" response is engaged at its highest level and I am suppressing the visibility of that to those around me. If I have determined that the best way to get out of this interaction alive is to appear totally calm and "normal', that is how I will appear - the old case of the duck legs paddling fast under the water to keep the duck still on top of the water. Freeze, I suspect, is a much more complex response than we want to imagine.
Yes good point, I will do a post on how different folks have different "set points", but here is something relevant to this that came up recently: https://vojo.health/comt-genes/
What's that "gut twist" when you're like driving along somewhere and then you have a thought, "Did I leave the gas on at home?" or something similar... is that the "freeze" dopamine rush?
I have been trying to get my medical team to pay attention to the different body chemicals produced for flight/fight on the one hand, and freeze on the other. They seem to have zero knowledge of the freeze response and how it operates.
We have assumed that freeze must be the rabbits in the headlights type freeze, while it might actually take the form of behaving apparently entirely normally while controlling every word or action for fear of one's life. It can actually be the calm response when others are panicking. I think many women can be trapped perpetually in this state, initially around abusive men, and after a while,around all men or authority figures, meaning that every move, every action, every word is carefully crafted to ensure safety. Apart from all the obvious psychological issues with this, there seems to be no information on what chemicals the human body produces in this sustained "freeze' response, and what else those chemicals might be doing to the body. I want my doctors to investigate this but they have nowhere to start. Many of the "syndromes" might come down to the impacts of the freeze response.
I am thinking of partial shut down - the diminishing of natural responses - so one acts as if all were normal. I am thinking of a childhood going to schools with a considerably (but lowkey) hostile environment.
Very good discussion of stress responses!
It might be interesting to further discuss the differences in how various people react. For example, some startle easily while others remain calm in the exact same situation. What accounts for why some people remain calm and clear headed when facing a threat, vs others that "panic"?
It might come down to how well we have learned to live with our personal version of the freeze response. I have lived in a permanent state of high anxiety all my life, which means I have actually learned how to live with it. I may appear calm and in control, when in fact every "danger" response is engaged at its highest level and I am suppressing the visibility of that to those around me. If I have determined that the best way to get out of this interaction alive is to appear totally calm and "normal', that is how I will appear - the old case of the duck legs paddling fast under the water to keep the duck still on top of the water. Freeze, I suspect, is a much more complex response than we want to imagine.
The "masking" sounds like the "Appease" aka "Fawn" or "Feign" stress response [not included here]
It sounds exhausting for you? I have a pathological level of social phobia even though I like and get on well with most people :/
Fascinating and excellent thought Christine.
Yes good point, I will do a post on how different folks have different "set points", but here is something relevant to this that came up recently: https://vojo.health/comt-genes/
Very interesting. Worth investigating further.
Interesting article.
What's that "gut twist" when you're like driving along somewhere and then you have a thought, "Did I leave the gas on at home?" or something similar... is that the "freeze" dopamine rush?
I'll have to ponder which one that is..,. definitely an example of self-stressing
Outstanding diagram, Gary. Saved.
I have been trying to get my medical team to pay attention to the different body chemicals produced for flight/fight on the one hand, and freeze on the other. They seem to have zero knowledge of the freeze response and how it operates.
We have assumed that freeze must be the rabbits in the headlights type freeze, while it might actually take the form of behaving apparently entirely normally while controlling every word or action for fear of one's life. It can actually be the calm response when others are panicking. I think many women can be trapped perpetually in this state, initially around abusive men, and after a while,around all men or authority figures, meaning that every move, every action, every word is carefully crafted to ensure safety. Apart from all the obvious psychological issues with this, there seems to be no information on what chemicals the human body produces in this sustained "freeze' response, and what else those chemicals might be doing to the body. I want my doctors to investigate this but they have nowhere to start. Many of the "syndromes" might come down to the impacts of the freeze response.
I too have pondered which neurotransmitters are responsible for the freeze response. Not sure if I shared this with prrviously, but I found a link to Glumatate [and hence GABA]... https://www.outthinkingparkinsons.com/articles/gut-part-2?rq=gut
Fascinating read, full of useful information, thank you!
Startle reflex, part of the newborn physical “neuro” exam. Someone obviously decided it was an important bodily function.
Watching videos of adults in startle is very reminiscent of the Moro reflex test in babies....
Well that last stage sounds terrifying.
Looks really interesting. I will study it
I am thinking of partial shut down - the diminishing of natural responses - so one acts as if all were normal. I am thinking of a childhood going to schools with a considerably (but lowkey) hostile environment.
Yes, I think this is called "functional freeze" in some communities.